Frankly speaking, Frank Nweke Jr., Minister for Inter-Governmental Affairs, Special Duties and Youth Development is an unusual man. For instance, it will be difficult to find with him a prepared speech. Not that he cannot read prepared speeches but he finds it more convenient to talk ex-tempore. Dressed in a cream pollo shirt, a pair of jeans trousers with a brown sandals to match, we headed for the interview not in his official four-wheel vehicle but that of his special adviser who of course was not particularly comfortable having his boss into his vehicle.
“So what is the difference between my car and yours”, he asked him jokingly.
“No be the same four tyres the cars get?”
Getting to the venue, a well secluded but open restaurant, without the ambience and luxury of a ministerial office, he revealed what he has been doing in the last one year since he was appointed.
How has it been in the last one year?
In the last one year? It has been a year of great challenge, interesting experience . The successes, failures, challenges, the hope and vision for the future. First of all, I tried to settle down to have a grip on the job, understanding what inter governmental relations meant just as some were asking me that what does this inter government business mean, I was also asking myself what is this inter governmental business and by the time I went through the file, research, search on the internet, interacted with friends and colleagues , the thought crystalised very clearly and I was not left in doubt at all that I had the most important portfolio in the country. Within weeks, I had my first memo to the President sitting on his desk requesting for him to approve a conduct of a study to find out why past attempts at collaborations among the three tiers of government had failed. I also had meetings with World Bank officials with whom have been acquainted or have had to do business with in the course of my work at Enugu. I asked for assistance and they were very keen in assisting the ministry and Mr President approved for them to conduct the study.
For the benefit of the readers, what is the function of the Inter-Governmental Affairs Ministry?
Basically, talking about the inter- governmental relations, there is nothing we are doing that is new. Over the years, governments have always understood that there was the need for effective inter governmental collaboration if things were to happen properly and effectively in our country. But it appears to have stopped at understanding that there is a need for such a thing but in practical terms, nothing happened. And to show you the extent to which government went, there used to have a Ministry for National Planning during the Shagari era, there was and still exists the National Planning Commission, National Council on Health, National Council on Education, on Works and all sorts.
The councils were supposed to provide opportunities or a platform for residual establishment to interact with state establishments to try to understand policies and programmes planned together. But our findings showed that some of the councils when they were held every year had actually been used as photo opportunities for some people, opportunities to collect duties allowances and to some people, opportunities to share some cups of tea and lunch so that no actual work went on at these fora. And the implication is that the inter governmental relations remained ineffective, uncoordinated which has translated to defective service delivery.
How do you mean?
Let me tell you what could happen or the kind of scenarios we face now due to the lack of sustainable frame work for inter governmental collaborations and inter governmental relations. For instance, the health care, it is my most favorite example. At the ederal level, what is the thrust of the National Health Policy? The thrust of the National Health Policy is Primary Health Care and it has been on for a long time.
The idea being that a stitch in time saves nine, that if you were to immunise the kid, if you were to take precautionary measures earlier on before manifestation of a disease or any health problem, it saves you a lot of troubles, it reduces the cost of administering tertiary health care and also enhances opportunities for survival, improves quality of life. But at the federal level, Primary Health Care, at the state level, Primary Health Care, at the Local government level, Primary Health Care but you find again say, as a Federal Minister, I approach my colleague in the Federal Ministry of Health , may be I have heard that the Federal Government is about to build health centers in this year’s budget, I can go to him and say, honorable minister, we are friends and colleagues, this thing that is going to Enugu, could you please let it go to my village in Ozara and he says why not Frank and the center from the Federal Government goes there. I go to the governor, I say your excellency my governor, your friend and brother, minister.
He says what is the problem and I tell him that the health post he plans to put in Nkanu Local Government, please, let it come to my village, he says why not and he decides to put it there for me. Then I go to the local government chairman who will tremble upon sighting me, (laughter). What is the problem and I tell him that this health center you plan to build , one has to be in my village. So what is going to happen is that, using my own influence and position, I could attract two, three health centers to the same locality and not a single one of the centres will work. So, I have three structures sitting there. None of the structures had medicine equipment, personnel but I have three structures. As a politician, I could say I have succeeded. Succeeded in the sense that you ask me what I have done and I tell you I brought these health centres to this locality, if not for me, it wouldn’t have been built, as a politician, I am going to flaunt those things.
This is hypothetical, just a scenario of what may have been happening?
Yes, let me explain: In terms of health care delivery, what would you honestly tell me that has been achieved by all those things. The one put by the federal does not work, the one by the state does not work and the one by the local government does not work but look at the scenario. Could we get say, the Federal Ministry of Health, using the platform of say, the National Council of Health, now makes the council more business like and say look, we are trying to review this policy on health care and all the commissioners for health, all people concerned now try to at least agree that the thrust of the national health care policy should be primary health. If everybody agrees on that, then you begin to think of the modalities to implementing the National Health Care policy , the thrust of which is Primary Health Care.
What it then means is that if you tell me that as the Federal Government, you are going to build in every local government, then as state governor, I will say don’t let me waste my money in trying to invest in the same thing but let me now invest in equipping the health centres that have been built or the state government tells the Federal Minister, sir, we have already built health centres in each of our local government but we don’t have equipment, use the money you have used in building the centres to equip the hospitals for us or no, we have equipment, our problems now is personnel, the personnel cost are too high, could you please help to pick up the personnel cost or could you please give us money to hire personnel to man these centres. that is the kind of collaborations that I envisage and that is why I say I have the most important ministry.
As I speak to you, the study is going on . My hope is that we would look at the report which I also expect to make recommendation for sustainable framework for inter governmental collaboration in our country. And I am hopeful that if we need to enact a law that we need to, we will do it because I believe that the success will be seriously jeopardised unless we can get the state government to actually log into this reform initiatives. You know that by the very nature of our constitution, the states are guaranteed some measure of autonomy, the same thing with the local government. So, you cannot actually enforce anything , you can only advocate, persuade and encourage them to embrace certain set of behaviors or process to focus on the people by sharing your ideas or ideals by logging into your policy because if the Federal Government concentrate on just implementing it at the federal level, how many people live in Abuja. Nigerians live in the states.
So, you can see why I am passionate about it, it is so important to me. For me, I don’t see any other way to go and I believe some state governors are amenable to what is going on but we must continue to try and push and achieve a situation where every state government does see itself as being in competition with the Federal Government of Nigeria. That we are one country with one people and what we are trying to do as a government is to guarantee the welfare and well being of our people and if I was a governor, in order to guarantee the well being and welfare of my people, I need to cooperate and collaborate with the Federal Government of Nigeria, I will not hesitate to do it unless I have ulterior motives.
One of the first few things you did on assuming duties was termination of a multi billion contract in the just concluded Ogunpa Channelisation work, was termination the only remedy?
I want you to appreciate where I am coming from, my attitude to the ministership. The ministership is not about me. I see it as a generational thing, it is about me, you and all the young men of this country. That is my perception about the ministership. Within days of becoming minister, I was presented with a set of files which I needed to approve money for running into several millions of naira for certificate to contractors handling the Lagos Shore line, Ogunpa Channelisation work and when I looked at it, I thought I needed to read these things to understand it. I didn’t think it was appropriate and expedient for me to just sign on these files just like that. Some people thought I should have signed it, my training forbids it.
I am a very organised person, with every sense of modesty. And by the time I read through the files, I didn’t like what I saw, I thought that those payments should not have been recommended and because of that, I thought I should go and carry out an inspection to see things for myself, just to reassure myself that what I found in the file was the same thing on the ground. I was even more delighted that I went after all and that I didn’t not those files especially the one on Ogunpa. I signed the one on the Lagos Shore line because I was happy with what I saw, besides, the contractor was being owed arrears and so on the Ogunpa project, we gave certain conditions to the contractors handling it because they were in phases. But we held series of meetings with one of the contractors during which we encouraged the contractor to try to at least bring up the amount of work done to be with the same level of money collected.
We agreed and we all signed to the agreement. But by the agreed deadline, nothing much had changed and before then, we got a visit from them during which certain overtures were made to us and I was very upset about this. Clearly, the people concerned believed that the reason why we were demanding to keep faith with the agreement signed was because overtures had not been made and I have a problem with that perception, even as a boy, I remember the Ogunpa flood and how young and old people were pulled out of the channel dead. For me now to have an opportunity as minister to make a difference because there are people who believe that every Nigerian is up for sale but I beg to differ. So, when the deadline expired and even gave them some more time and no improvement, I had to terminate the contract. I have no regret about it. If I needed to do it all over again, I will do it all over again.
Were you under any pressure at the time you were taking that decision?
I was not under any pressure from anybody because indeed, Mr President had always encouraged us to exercise our best judgment. He supported us all the way. When we sought approval to escalate the matter to hand over the matter to certain agencies of government charged with tackling such issues, he encouraged us to do that, he approved it to be done. He has always supported us from any quarters.
What is the relationship between you and contractors handling ecological funds projects across the country?
It has been cordial but we have had to change the orientation of our contractors about government projects so that nobody thinks government money is everybody’s money. And I think that has sunk into everybody now that if you do a job involving the Federal Government, it must be done thoroughly otherwise, you will not be paid. Nobody will take government money and go scot free without getting the job done. This has been established. But beyond that, most of the projects we have had to tackle and talk about in the last one year were projects initiated by my predecessors so that as I speak to you, since I became minister, we have not awarded a single ecological funds projects. But recently, following the meetings of National Committee on Ecological Problems, we have made recommendations to the president and in the coming weeks, you are going to see calls for tender and bids in national dailies and the President has graciously approved about 26 new projects in about 26 states of the federation. We have some in Ogun, Adamawa, Abia, Zamfara, Gombe, Enugu, Imo, Plateau, Kebbi and many other states.
These projects are worth N9 billion which is expected to take care of different ecological and environmental problems. These are the kind of things we are going to be doing in the next coming months.
You were Chief of Staff to the Enugu State governor before your appointment, what were you doing before the Enugu State appointment?
I was running a private enterprise, I was involved in a family business which my father established in 1976 and I practically took it over shortly after I left the university in 1989 and we were dealing with office automation. The governor had not always lived in Nigeria, he was based in the United States until 1996 when he began to shuttle between the U.S and Nigeria and eventually he got elected as governor. After he was elected, he was shopping for credible young men whom he could work with and I was recommended to him by somebody. We met in Lagos at the Sheraton, he invited me over to Enugu where I was first engaged as consultant to the government. Subsequently, he appointed me as the state coordinator of what you might call community council county which was essentially a poverty alleviation initiative for rural community which sought to uplift the living standards of the rural populace through the provision of basic infrastructure. I was there barely a year when he appointed me as the Chief of Staff and I was on the job for about 2 and 3 months before I was nominated for the ministership position.
Your boss, the President, is seen as having an overbearing tendency, you have worked closely with him, what kind of person is Chief Obasanjo?
The truth is that I don’t know where people get this kind of perception about the president. I frankly do not know because I like to use my self as an example. People tend to forget that I am a minister, I am appointed at the discretion of Mr President, just like other appointees. Of course, you have a right to proffer counsel, advice to your boss but your boss also has the right to either accept or not because come to think of it, the bulk stops with him. He is the one that has the mandate of the Nigerian people, not you the ministers or advisers.
And that don’t forget, you are dealing with someone who has been fortunate to garner a lot of experiences, he spent a greater part of his life in public service, some of us have not. So you offer him advice, he weighs it on the basis of his experience, history and circumstances in which we are at any particular time, then he takes the final decision. As far as I am concerned, I will not subscribe to the notion that the president is overbearing because I have not suffered it and I have worked with him very closely.
You send him a memo, sometimes you seat with him and discuss it with him, he asks you questions, are you sure that is what you want? Are you sure it is correct and are you sure you will be able to push it? You say yes, he says fine, go ahead. I believe that is what happens to my colleagues too. One thing I know of the president is that he abhors any form of dishonesty, indiscipline. I know that much about him and I know that he has a messianic disposition about our country. He is obsessed with leaving a legacy, putting the country on a path of economic and social recovery. That much I know about him. When you meet him, in his utterances, actions, he does not leave you in doubt about what he thinks about our country and what he wants to do for the country as long as he lives.
So, I cannot subscribe to that perception about the President and I say this with every sense of responsibility and frankness. He is an objective man who bows to superior knowledge. But I also know that he does not suffer fools.
